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(I just twittered this post).
I am shocked that it took 10 people 2 years to figure out you have to be trusted and provide value...this should be obvious.
Did you mention being real - this is essential in an environment where people are not able to hide easily. It also creates goodwill.
(Typo in statement 9 part 2 - you can edit if required)
Regards
James
I could not agree more with you! You've done a great job in organizing your findings in a meaningful way. It all comes down to the relationship that you build. And... isn't that how it is in the non-virtual world as well?
Rita Wilhelm
Slow is good though because that means you reached some people... Where you can reach some, you can reach many... just rinse and repeat.
@Jay and @itayi - thank you for reading and commenting.
My analogy is people like to watch soaps and even folow what is happening with character they don't like, with social sites the same type of human nature prevails, people pick up on your character and like to be updated with what's happening. Even better they have the choice of interacting, both people and search engines can find inconsistencies and trickery the result is the same both will dump you.
Following your lead, Be yourself be true and work on social sites like real time diary entry's, works for me, the trust level builds and the circle of influence increases.
I look forward to the next article.
John
We needed to learn how to teach traditional Internet marketers and marketing firms to move their thinking in regard to social media. The approach is totally awkward to marketers.
Furthermore, we had to categorize the social networks so their purpose in regard to business application could be understood by marketers.
There is a lot behind the scenes and it does seem that we have come up with some obvious or common sense conclusions... but we had to test from a marketer's perspective in order to show them how to shift their gears.
I agree ... Being real should be one of the statements above ... I knew I missed one!
@John Austwick - Thank you for the insightful comment
There is a lot of misinformation about social media marketing, some internet marketing guru's are telling people to put up multiple profiles on as many social networks as possible and link to their main site with keywords in the anchor text. I've seen some of these profiles on places like Squidoo and Hubpages, the content consists of 1 or 2 sentences and then a link. This isn't adding anything of value to these social networks and these pages should be taken down in my opinion. It's just plain trickery!
At the end of the day, you've got to add value and be real and honest.
I look forward to reading further posts in this series.
John O'Hara
United Kingdom
I think testing is a great way to arrive at a conclusion!
Possibly the main social networks are in the business of data selling and have users contribute content. So it seems fair they can also be used for legitimate linking purposes.
The main adjustment for old marketers is the fact that they can't just ram it one way anymore. People can just un-follow and they have been voted off instantly. There is more accountability than before. (That is why I mentioned being real).
The smart ones are quickly scrambling to learn social media with declarations like "I was wrong about Twitter - it really is good...."
This is a great revolution for the industry.
Regards
James
So many marketers are trying to get as many hits as they can in whatever way they can. This mostly leads to unsocial behavior.
Social Networking is about being SOCIAL. Socializing is a 2 way street. The biggest thing marketers don't get is that People buy things from People.
If you're not COMMUNICATING with the people you're selling to, then you're missing the boat. I have at least 50% of my traffic from social sites. The thing is, these visitors Already "Know" me because I'm in their community on the social site they hangout in. Conversions rates go through the roof when those visitors come in.
Charles, I'd love to post your article on SocialMediaLandscape.com, with your permission of course.
I've purchased a couple of Social Marketing ebooks and most of the information out there is basically crap - a thin attempt to force-fit Black Hat SEO techniques to this "new" media. One I have actually suggests that you should have at least 10 accounts at 10 different social media sites. That's 100 accounts to keep track of!! Who has time for that??
One thing I like about Charles (and why I've purchased his products in the past) is that he makes sense.
Hiram
www.balance-your-health.com
Its all about engagement and ROI, the chicken or the egg and what are you looking for. Obviously we all want to make money, but perhaps most do not realize that this is not your 1980's business model of intrusive, in your face marketing. It's even more than Godin's permission based marketing.
Marc
Please keep it up, I'll be reading.
www.thesupergreenpages.com
More and more I am bonding with my market via Twitter, Facebook, Ustream & MySpace, etc. More and more, they are purchasing because of Social Media.
Many of my clients have lots more fans (and link love) than I do, and one has even decided to put on an annual:
http://SocialMarketersCruise.com
which came about from just a few tweets on Twitter. A-list marketers who sometimes take days (if at all) to answer an email inquiry...seem to answer in seconds on places like Twitter. Amazing!
"Captain Lou" Edwards
Personally what makes social networks different in todays digital landscapes is that is a place where brands try to own people and can't unless they are being real, sincere and keeping the dialogue going.
Easier said than done as you said at the beginning of your piece - after two years of observation - it does all seem common sense, but then again digital wasn't meant to be all about rocket science !
I enjoyed reading your opening article and look forward to the following ones and yes it has opened up a debate which is what the whole thing is about ....
Re. statement two, specifically the following passage::
We have evidence that Google is paying attention to the level of “community” and “friendship” and “voting” that occurs within accounts that list your website link.
-- would you be able to elaborate that statement -- prefereably with some kind of documentation? Is it based on somebody else's analysis or is it in-house generated knowledge?
I perfectly understand that you might not be able to disclose the source, however, it'd be great knowing a bit more about the nature of the evidence.
Thanks in advance,
Bergholt
two way dialogue - both positive and not!
There is another thing I would bring up - it is easy to get pulled into a whirlpool where there seem to be so many social networks "that one should be a part of" and so many other Web 2.0 activities one can engage on, I think it can pendulum swing too easily. Would it be better to dabble in 5 networks, or to find one or two that are really fitting and really get involved. Personally I have a Facebook account, for example, but I really don't have a clue on what to do with it! I don't really understand Facebook. That's just an example. Then I read how I should also have this, that, and the other profile. Meanwhile I am barely keeping up with posting on my own blogs ...
Anyway, maybe it's better to spend more time within a few networks than to splatter yourself all over a whole horde of them? That's my thought.
Clue its in the story line below this one at the top of the page.
Looks rather good and downloading it for myself.
As for your statement #5 I think you are lumping all internet marketers together including you and me, and basically saying they don't know anything, which is stereotyping and uncalled for.
I'd suggest there's a range of internet marketers from very social media friendly ones to hard core "squeeze page, email blast" types. I think you're talking about the latter end of the spectrum and surely you're not talking about IM 2.0 types or some of us who are in the middle using the best of both?
BR,
Peter
Steve
@Peter Konig - No disrespect meant re: item#5 sorry it came across that way.
@Steve @Caroline T - Thank you
@Anna - You're right... All the social networks out there are dizzying and you really only need to be involved in a few to be effective.
@Marc Meyer - Thank you for the insightful comment... I will be reading your take shortly after I post this comment.
Most approaches have been to throw mud agasint the social wall and see what sticks. Maybe now we are at Web 2.1
I am looking forward to the rest of this series.
Alas, this is becoming short-lived as people are finding ways to use social media to entice people to link to their websites and landing pages. ROI is just another effort to measure how to invade the social media spaces. For internet marketers, it is of course essential to learn how to get people to their sales landing pages. I imagine, your report will be quite informative and all your study will lead to new ways to get to social media users.
Thanks for your work.
cellfood man
Cellfood review
– would you be able to elaborate that statement — prefereably with some kind of documentation? Is it based on somebody else’s analysis or is it in-house generated knowledge?
@Bergholt - I will elaborate on this statement ... We do have evidence and I cannot share the evidence that we have shown for our clients but I can share my own. Anticipating this question I began monitoring the phrase "return on investment in social media" immediately after I posted this. Following are points to noto:
1. Indexing on new blog posts usually happens within 5 - 15 minutes on Google (on this blog). We came in at position 40 for the term this morning.
2. At this moment we are holding at position 4
3. I watched the position rise as the content was crowdsourced and linked to from several blogs (thanks to everyone).
This is not an isolated event ... I/we have been observing this trend for the past several months. With Google courting Digg for a buyout (and acquiring other social platforms and filing several relevant patents) among other things we see strong evidence that Google is paying attention to user voted content.
All we have is the evidence and we are not the only ones seeing this. This is what I call The New SEO. There was never a focus on SEO yet there is strong SEO benefit to creating good content that is favored by communities... A by product if you will.
Just like the email you sent out Charles "As you may know we have been involved in deep research into this very question for a long time. I have devoted the man hours of 9 people plus myself for 2 years to come to the following conclusions:" ... it drove me here and Ive read quite a few comments and clicked through the name URL to there sites just like any one would on the social media sites wall ...
... Statement 10: You must listen to your target audience to determine their needs before engaging them ... SO If you can crack the email code you can crack the social media code thats for sure ... as I stated ... same same ... only communication and filling needs
All my best to you and your wants
Phillip Skinner
Social media is like white hat seo. Takes time but the reward is great when done right.
Looking forward to more
Thanks for the elaboration and the figures. I see you've jumped to 2nd position.
The reason I asked for evidence is that I've seen numerous campaigns/blog posts/web sites being promoted through a host of social bookmarking services -- with great effect, even though users did not vote/buzz/blink up the compaing/post/sites.
On the other hand, I do agree with your general conclusion that Google's algorithms are paying attention to authentic & virally spreading linking -- e.g. people blogging about this post, submitting it to social news sites, etc.
Re. SEO -- sure there's huge potentiel. With RSS feeds and easy syndication & stream aggregation a lot is possible.
/Kasper
Excellent post. And a very good way to start a conversation about conversations.
Key point is that social media is with a Capital "S". That's what it's for.
I'll try to keep this pithy:
Statement 1: Social media isn't for marketing as most people know and practice marketing. The "Cluetrain Manifesto"explains this best for those who want to understand how most people were trained to market - and how they are going to have to change it.
Social media is for socializing. Period. You can't get into a sales page or landing page from there directly. Like the life insurance salesmen who belong to all sorts of groups - they get prospects and leads, but take their sales "offline" and don't do it in front of everyone at the group meeting.
I've posted this earlier in using "breadcrumbs" to turn social media contacts into sales.
Generally speaking, you don't get direct sales from social media.
Reason: they are there for the experience. If they were there to buy something, they'd be at an auction site - a community for buyers and sellers.
Social conversationalists (we need a term here - not "socialites") will look you up if they respect your content, your posts, your comments, your videos. Also depends on volume and frequency as well as contribution to the community - something people want and are looking for.
Statement 2: "Link love" is a dead/dying SEO strategy. Google is moving away from their old algorithms such as pagerank, which is what link love was supposed to influence. It's dead because it became a spammer tactic. The continuing successful strategy is quality content - which cannot be spammed, because it must be original and creative.
If you want top search engine positions, just submit great content using and about your keyword phrase to several social media - because Google sees that fresh original content is still King.
Statement 3: Someone broke down social networks into three types, which I believe go: a) bookmarking media, b)social media, c)review media. I think there might also be one just for networking, such as LinkedIn - but this is probably just a subset of social media - Facebook itself is used for both. The bookmarking aspect of StumbleUpon is changing over to a network function, so you can find out what other people are finding - not just popularize your own links (as above).
Statement 4: True. The term "edutainment" encompasses all three. Also - tell a story. This is the way people actually think (and change their minds) - by comparing their stories to others. (And why a movie tends to "stick around" in your mind for days - you're still digesting the story line and character interaction.)
Statement 5: If anyone was ever trained into thinking that you just needed to shout your message a given number of times and it would be accepted, they've been grossly mistrained - or are just hacks and spammers. True, 2-3% will buy out of any offer presented, but this simply won't work in social media - any shouting like that will get you kicked out of that network/media.
The community polices its own. Unlike newspapers and other media which are profit-based, not trust and communication based. Cluetrain Manifesto again.
Statement 6: OK. Manners apply, for instance. Netiquette, and so on.
Statement 7: Sales do not come from social media per se. See the breadcrumbs post above. Your content and persistent contributions gain trust - then they go to check out what you're all about. You get sales from your other pages, not the social media. ("You don't get down from an elephant, you get down from a goose." - old joke repurposed...)
Statement 8: What was known as "traditional SEO" can almost be dropped on its head and forgotten. SEO has evolved and continues to - since it follows search engine evolution. The only standard has been good content. Social media allowed us to spread that content around in more entertaining formats - rather than just text (WWW vs. Usenet.) Current best SEO tactics are page themeing (LSI) and social posts - which brings us back to square one above, high-quality conversations.
The first question any SEO-er should ask: "How can I best serve the Internet community as a whole?" and then, "What can I give others that will improve their experience?" From that you get niche-strategies, as we can't all be Amazon.com's. (Long Tail.)
Statement 9: Branding IS trust. It's not positioning. Leave that to marketing. SEO's job is to deliver the goods of a) traffic, b) potential leads, c) conversions. ROI is defined in terms of these three, although Conversion is a team effort and beyond simple SEO.
A note here - opt-in traffic from social media has proven to be very fickle and flighty. Opt-in is just as quickly opt-out. People "here for the experience" are not people "here to buy something." So your target isn't just volume traffic - you have to get people to buy enough that you can afford those bandwidth spikes.
Statement 10 - You have to actually become a member of that community first. Note that all communities are filled with niches. There is no generic "Tweeter" or "Stumbleuponner" or anything else. Do you homework first - and then join those networks where your particular niche is. But then you must really find out what that niche wants and deliver it. At THAT point, you can work on attracting leads and conversions on your own site.
- - - -
OK, too much ramble - but I hope you've all gotten something out of this. Thanks for your patience for reading this far.
Robert
But that's just based on my personal experiences and application.
I don't agree Social Media is just for socializing.
Thank you for your excellent contribution to this thread.
Example: I've said that social media can't be used for marketing (or something to that effect) - better, it is that social media can't be used for the "whole cycle" of marketing. Meaning, yes - you build trust and get people curious about you and what your company produces, but carrying out the conversion of leads to sales has to take place offline, out of the social media area proper.
Lots of deals may have been forged while on the golf course - but they weren't playing golf at the time. They were doing a deal, even while leaning on that golf club or talking over mixed drinks at the club. But even then, the paperwork was concluded back at the office.
Social media promotion is completely acceptable - within the rules of that particular social media. Mostly, this is in the form of giving high-quality, valuable content - with a link to your website, blog, or email.
Digg used to be "hell on wheels" in this regard - stuff was voted out of existence and removed. However, it's become so big that now you can digg your own stuff and it stays there for a long time with no one except the search engines noticing. Other sites are similar.
And you don't have to be extremely popular to effectively promote your stuff - we are all mostly working on long-tail niches to be successful in online marketing after all.
The point is social media promotion, yes; full-cycle social media marketing, no.
Hope this clarifies...
You are right. Social Media gets you the relationship. They get to "know" you. But the real magic happens when you take them from a Social Networking site to your own place. Or hell even pick up the phone or direct email.
I've always said it... People buy from People. So use the Social Sites to be social and converse with your targeted market, but let them come to you. Your intention shouldn't be to make the sale, it should be to genuinely help and bring value to that community.
when that is done, they will come. And when they do, they will be loyal and mostly evangelists!
That's the formula.
Your comment adds a great deal of clarification to the overall point of this post.
- Charles
Sylvia Buetow